Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

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Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby dmac » Sun Apr 10, 2011 1:27 pm

In drawing up a detailed crime scene map, it's become clear to me that the staging (deliberate placement) of bodies involves each victim found in Cabin 28. We've known for some time that Johnny was dragged at some point- his jogging pants prove that, as they're rotated around the front towards his right hip, and pulled several inches down his right hip.

Take a look at this mock-up of the position of Johnny's body:

Image

The green portion is the down vest he was wearing. This vest was not buttoned up, yet was cinched under his arms in a position also indicating he was dragged- in the same direction as his pants. However, the vest also proves he was not dragged into the position he was found. Look at how both of his arms are resting on top of the vest. There is only one possible way for that to happen.

After being dragged, he was lifted off the ground. The vest hung free below him as he was lifted, face up, from the floor, and it spread out evenly below him as it made contact with the floor before his body did. It's the only way his arms could come to rest atop the vest folded below.

It also indicates he was likely lifted by two people- one at the shoulders and one at the feet- because the long tail of the vest (which would likely have remained under his butt if he'd been dragged) had to hang free, too, for this to happen.

On top of that, the position of his legs and feet-- his right foot off the ground, resting precariously on the heel of the left, which was cocked unnaturally askew-- indicate they were moved by the perps after he was set into that position.

    Johnny was dragged at some point, pulling his pants and down vest askew.

    Then lifted and set into place- by two perps- allowing his vest to droop down and spread out so his arms came to rest atop the vest.

    His legs and feet were then manipulated as a perp struggled with the dead weight of his legs to tie the white extension cord around his ankles, which were not taped.

Remember, Johnny's legs were the only ones not bound by tape. It appears Johnny's legs were not bound at all until after he was already unconscious or dead.

.
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby Ausgirl » Mon Apr 11, 2011 7:35 am

I recall studying that white cord with you, D - and us observing the knots, how they both face upward from the boys' legs and slightly inward toward the gap between - indicating that they might have been tied post-mortem.

This brilliant find of yours just confirms that thought -- and leads to the obvious question of: "Why?"

I mean. Why go to the trouble of tying a cord connecting their legs, when clearly it had nothing to do with disabling motion. Is it symbolic? Is it some sort of message to somebody? Some gesture of importance to the killer? Or was it part of a staging process designed to disguise the crime's real motive?

Another thing that just does not add up at all.
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby truthseeker » Mon Apr 11, 2011 4:26 pm

I agree that the bodies were repositioned. A desperate attempt to confuse the csi.
Just a thought.
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby frida » Mon Apr 11, 2011 5:40 pm

In my opinion the staging was done to confuse the scene. To make it hard to trace what happened to whom, when and where. To obfuscate the motive, the primary target, the actions committed by each perp at the scene. Basically to make a mess out of the scene so anyone studying it would come to the wrong conclusions about what happened. Staging a crime scene paints a picture. A picture that speaks to both the perps and to the person viewing the crime scene.
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby Ausgirl » Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:13 am

Kind of gives substantial pause to the idea that this was merely a drug-fuelled rampage, or what was left behind in the wake of a drunken rape attempt gone wrong.

Somebody had their wits about them, all too clearly.

To obfuscate the motive, the primary target, the actions committed by each perp at the scene. Basically to make a mess out of the scene so anyone studying it would come to the wrong conclusions about what happened.

So what -was- the motive (and might we, in light of the staging, see what it was not)?

Who was the primary target as -presented- by the staging? From what crime was it hoped this staging might divert attention, and why?
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby frida » Wed Apr 13, 2011 9:21 am

I have never felt it was a drug fueled rampage or strictly an attempt at rape gone wrong. I believe the perps went there with the intent to mess with Sue--whether they fully intended to rape her I do not know. I also do not know if one perp went with rape in mind and the other did not or if both did or neither. Quite possibly one was flying by the seat of his pants (yeah--let's get that bitch!) and the other was bringing medical tape and planning out what he wanted to do all along (you want to get that bitch? I'll show you how it's done you piker).

By obfuscate the motive, primary target and actions committed by each perp at the scene, I did not mean to imply that the staging presented definite alternatives for these things as we have come to know them. For example the overkill of the victims could have been meant to suggest multiple perps, drug induced mayhem (think manson family) or retaliation for a drug deal gone wrong. If Sue was the primary target--as we have come to believe--one would think the boys would have been dispatched quickly once they interrupted the attack. The multiple attacks on Johnny and Dana to a certain extent may have been meant to obscure Sue as the primary focus. If all the victims appear to have been savagely attacked--who was the main focus of the rage? Do you see where I am going with this? Excessive binding of the victims after death might have been meant to suggest they were methodically bound and perhaps tortured before being killed instead of merely being restrained in order to control them. Moving the bodies around could have been done to obscure who was struck first, when and where.

In my mind the staging was done to suggest many things, not just definite alternatives to what actually happened. The perps wanted it to be as confusing as possible for anyone viewing and analyzing the scene. Along with this the staging probably did include little signatures of the perps (the knots tied a certain way, gagging the victim with her panties, etc.)
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby awareness » Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:14 pm

I believe B/M are the perpetrators - they could have gone in not thinking it would escalate so much, yet after they'd finished they may have had a notion to sabotage the scene by moving bodies, adding bindings etc. in order to deflect suspicion on themselves. This may or may not have happened right after the murders, or possibly one or both returned later in the night. Which makes me wonder what, if anything, Justin did himself after B/M left. Did he cover Sue? Did he try and put a cushion under Dana's head? Or was the cushion something that happened during the crime itself and they covered Sue up after the fact out of remorse (doubtful those slimeballs knew what remorse actually was).
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby Chichibcc » Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:54 pm

awareness wrote: Did he try and put a cushion under Dana's head? Or was the cushion something that happened during the crime itself


I'd always been curious about how the cushion ended up on the floor like that, but given the weird angle at which Dana's head was lying on it, I'm betting that was part of the staging process. Also, given how far away it was from the couch, almost in the center of the room, it's hard to believe that it could've merely "fallen off" during the attacks-it had to had been moved intentionally.
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby Ausgirl » Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:49 am

Those are some very good points, Frida. I was more responding to theories about the perps being out of control and drug-crazed than your own, in the post above - where my mind was headed was trying to get inside the perp's reasoning... such as it was... for such extensive staging.

I've been turning over various scenarios as to -why- they did what they did, in the specific way it was done, because it does seem so deliberate. For example, the fact that so much trouble (and time, furthering risk of discovery) was taken to bind people who were already incapacitated and then attack them -again- makes it seem that way moreso than had the bodies simply been hauled about more randomly. Something that really bothers me re Sue being the main target of the crime is that all the staging around her suggests exactly that - that she was the main target of the crime. So then, why would they 'present' her in precisely that way?

Which has lead me to speculate a lot about alternative targets. Tina, primarily, as she was removed from the crime scene altogether. Did Sue wake up in the living room and interrupt Tina's abduction in another room, followed by the boys? I've considered whether one or both of the boys were the real target, and Sue's excessive binding and Tina's abduction were to take attention away from that. I've even pondered the idea that the crime itself was not 'aimed' at the Sharps at all - of course, they were its victims but the 'message' of the staging could have been aimed at somebody else entirely (LE, DoJ, a local criminal not toeing whatever line). I just keep turning all this around in my head, thinking sooner or later some penny will drop somewhere and things will become a bit clearer. It's helped to figure a few minor and incidental things, so there's no harm in it. Except it drives me nuts. :shock:
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby SecretAgentHolly » Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:39 pm

Ausgirl wrote:I've been turning over various scenarios as to -why- they did what they did, in the specific way it was done, because it does seem so deliberate. For example, the fact that so much trouble (and time, furthering risk of discovery) was taken to bind people who were already incapacitated and then attack them -again- makes it seem that way moreso than had the bodies simply been hauled about more randomly. Something that really bothers me re Sue being the main target of the crime is that all the staging around her suggests exactly that - that she was the main target of the crime. So then, why would they 'present' her in precisely that way?




MAYBE, just maybe, the "staging" was intentional in that it was made to look like Sue was the target, when in reality she was not. =-)

*ALSO - about the blood and the cushion: I was thinking that at one point the killers began to get nervous about possible evidence. They weren't blind. They saw all the blood splayed every fucking where. I think the cushion was deliberate to cease any further possible leakage of blood. The blanket on Sue was never an act of "remorse" , it was another security measure. The bodies were bound (even though they were dead) just as extra security to make sure none of them moved and spread more blood. The Killers had to have seen the bloody footprints and i think at that point is when they started to do *Damage Control*.

sorry. that's all i've got right now feel free to rip me apart... :x_x:
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby Chichibcc » Fri Apr 15, 2011 5:00 am

Oh, no-those are some really good theories-the only thing I disagree with you on is the blanket-I really think it was Justin that covered Sue.
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby awareness » Fri Apr 15, 2011 3:13 pm

Chichibcc wrote:
awareness wrote: Did he try and put a cushion under Dana's head? Or was the cushion something that happened during the crime itself


I'd always been curious about how the cushion ended up on the floor like that, but given the weird angle at which Dana's head was lying on it, I'm betting that was part of the staging process. Also, given how far away it was from the couch, almost in the center of the room, it's hard to believe that it could've merely "fallen off" during the attacks-it had to had been moved intentionally.

Someone, either a perp or a victim, could have grabbed it off the couch and thrown it towards whomever during the attack. Im not saying that's what did happen, but it could have. But if someone was just grabbing random items makes you wonder why more stuff wasnt picked up and thrown about. Im not convinced the perps would have done it after the fact, why wouldnt they put Dana's head on it all the way. Im also not convinced Justin would have done it, it was probably too gruesome for a young boy to deal with. JMO.
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby Chichibcc » Fri Apr 15, 2011 3:42 pm

awareness wrote: Im also not convinced Justin would have done it, it was probably too gruesome for a young boy to deal with. JMO.


I used to think that Justin might've placed it there, but given the weird angle at which Dana's head was lying on the cushion, that didn't seem likely.
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby SecretAgentHolly » Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:00 pm

i tend to agree Chichibcc .
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby kim1939 » Sun Apr 17, 2011 4:51 pm

wow i did know about someone moveing johnnys body this whole thng makes sad and mad at the same time simple fact tishe was my friend and one question i have is why did they move him in the first place ? >:-(
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Re: Johnny's Body Was Picked Up and Lowered Into Position

Postby awareness » Wed Apr 27, 2011 4:31 pm

Sorry for your loss Kim. Its awful this whole crime took place to begin with, who's to say why someone did another senseless act by moving his body.
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