Cops, Shrinks, Confessions Revisited

theories and spec; back up posts w/ reasoning and evidence/examples

Cops, Shrinks, Confessions Revisited

Postby joe_mcplumber » Thu Dec 31, 2015 3:12 pm

The whole business with (unnamed PCSO deputy) and Chuck and Henry... the discipline, the procedural progression, the tenacity, the systematic harassment... got me to comparing it with the perfunctory and civil conversations between LE, Marty, and Bo over tea and crumpets.

I look at the reports on Chuck and Henry and i think, "this is cop work". It's also 100% bullshit serving no purpose to the investigation, but it's cop work. This is what they do. They loom over you with their badges and weapons and authority knowing that this in itself will rattle you and give you brain farts. They find an inconsistency or a contradiction and they doggedly expound on it, making it bigger and bigger until it's the most blatant, incriminating lie ever told. They tell you that you're full of shit and you're in a lot of trouble for it, you're going to jail to be raped, you'll lose your job and your family will starve, etc.. Over and over again. They do this because it works sometimes, on real criminals, to trip them up and get leads or maybe a confession. But it works just as well just for the fun of it.

Anyways follow the timeline. Marty freakin' CONFESSES to the crime and two months later the cops are trying to railroad some guys for disagreeing over the color of a truck. Meanwhile Josh offers only two of "many" documents describing LE's intense interest in Marty's whereabouts after he left, but neither are dated anywhere near to the time he left.


Even back in those dark medieval days and primitive places, we had laws. California WIC Section 5150, or 72 hour hold, provides for involuntary detention for three days if a shrink or a cop determines a subject to be a "danger to self or others". It is a broad and subjective standard which permits the immediate imprisonment of practically anyone, for practically any pretense, with even fewer rights than an accused criminal. But it's especially easy to invoke if the subject is already known to, or in the care of, a mental health professional or institution, i suppose because nobody cares about the civil rights of crazy people.

I think, as laws go, this one is disgusting and uncivilized but it's still the law despite what i think. It's an extrajudicial process that's handy for quickly placing a subject in stasis while you figure out what to do with him. So in this case i think it was just what the doctor should've ordered.

Why did Marty's shrink let him get away?

I wondered, maybe because he was in Nevada with different laws but nope, they have an almost exact equivalent of a 5150, and they had it in 1981. I wondered if the criteria were different or too restrictive, but nope they're practically identical and just as subjective and conveniently elastic...

NRS433A.115“Person with mental illness” defined.[b]
      1.  As used in NRS 433A.115 to 433A.330, inclusive, unless the context otherwise requires, [b]“person with mental illness” means any person whose capacity to exercise self-control, judgment and discretion
... (is diminished) ... to the extent that the person presents a clear and present danger of harm to himself or herself or others,...

      3.  A person presents a clear and present danger of harm to others if, within the immediately preceding 30 days, the person has, as a result of a mental illness, inflicted or attempted to inflict serious bodily harm on any other person, or made threats to inflict harm and committed acts in furtherance of those threats, and if there exists a reasonable probability that he or she will do so again ...

I think that committing a brutal murder or two should qualify. Was it the 30 day thing? I think it was just about expired at the time, but that seems awful nit-picky given the circumstances, and not something they couldn't get around. This is initially an extrajudicial process and you don't get a lawyer to argue technicalities for you. The counselor knew that a 72 hour hold is effectively incapacitating, and he knew of its unofficial usefulness vis-a-vis criminal matters. Just possibly, it just wasn't feasible, but knowing what i know about how stretchy its feasibility can be, i think it could've been done. If he wanted it done.

So i wondered, maybe this particular counselor was especially enamored of privacy laws or conventions. Maybe he had to wrestle with his own professional ethics before he called the cops. This sadly seems very likely, since he apparently made other calls to talk it out and the Cheeseman said that he (unnamed counselor) was reluctant to turn Marty in. Only i can't help but think, screw the ethics and even the possible legalities, any hesitation at all in such circumstances makes this guy a,, a word i am reluctant to apply, because i am trying to be gracious because i don't know everything. But i mean all he has to say for his self is "well, you know, confidentiality and honor and stuff". Apparently honor is applicable in the morning, but not in the afternoon. Derp.

Nevermind, to hell with grace, he is a dipshit. In any case, he did eventually make the call and he was interviewed by the DOJ.


If Marty admitted to killing the females then that meant he had knowledge of an accomplice, likely the location of a missing victim, and at least one more evidence-filled crime scene around said victim. There was a possibility he was lying, and that Tina hadn't been killed yet. There was a possibility he was telling the truth, and doesn't that make for an entirely new and different criminal investigation, an opportunity to start again from there, with renewed vim and vigor?

Wasn't Tina still technically a kidnap victim and subject to FBI jurisdiction?

Seems like plenty of opportunities and plenty of justification for at least four different agencies to put the smackdown on Marty, (and maybe, no matter how unlikely, to save the life of a little girl), but near as i can tell they didn't do ANYTHING. I can almost understand the story about being frustrated, for lacking hard evidence against him, but this confession should've lit a fire under their butts if for no other reason than because it was a lead on Tina.

So then i wondered, what happened after the counselor's interview? Did the PCSO and DOJ consult with lawyers and prosecutors and determine that Marty's rights had been violated, so they had no standing to bring him in? But surely they at least discussed the implications before crossing any legal or ethical lines in the first place, if they had doubts then why do the interview until they could work around the lines? The following pertains to inpatients in involuntary custody, but it shows that mental health records are not inviolable or off limits to a warrant:

NRS 433.482  Personal rights.

Each consumer (chuckle, snort) admitted for evaluation, treatment or training to a facility has the following personal rights, a list of which must be prominently posted in all facilities providing those services and must be otherwise brought to the attention of the consumer by such additional means as prescribed by regulation:
8.  Except as otherwise provided in NRS 439.538, to have access to the consumer’s medical records denied to any person other than:
(...)blah blah blah(...)
(c) A person who obtains a court order authorizing the access.

The Cheeseman was acting in a private capacity when he called in his info, which seems like it should been actionable in itself. Like, enough for a warrant to get Marty's records. Anyhow cops all the time act on tips and half-assed evidence... the point, at that point, isn't the conviction it's getting the suspect into custody to be broken. The cops previously had him IN A CELL and they had cause to keep him there and interrogate him for his threats to Wade. Instead they grilled Wade, to ask him what he thought Marty might've meant?

At LEAST, contact him and say to him, "hey guess what someone told us your therapist said", and watch to see what happens next? Maybe he'd fumble it right then and there. Or maybe he'd panic and lead them to evidence or other POIs. Maybe he'd cut and run but who cares if you're gonna tell him to get outa town anyhow? Or with any luck maybe Marty's body would turn up in the forest, because Bo got tired of his mouth. (Which is a whole other thing... if Bo was really a wiseguy, why'd he tolerate all that yapping and public drama? It's not like the cops were right on his butt, hindering his work.)

Maybe i'm on shaky ground here because i don't really know what i'm talking about, i mean, i'm not a cop or a lawyer and i was not present at any Illuminati meetings on the subject. But cops have their own tricks of the trade to make things happen as they would have things happen and in Plumas County at the time, they could certainly work with the DA to make them happen properly. Almost everything i'm reading says, they didn't want something to happen. Unless you were named Chuck, or Henry.

And maybe all this has been said before, maybe y'all already dug so deep in these shadows that my musings appear redundant and quaintly ignorant.

But this whole thing makes no sense unless...

1.) Law enforcement, almost all of it, from PCSO management all the way up to the federal level, was utterly incompetent. They were so ashamed of their bumbling idiocy that they latched on to the first two guys to stupidly make themselves available, so as to be able to say they were looking at "persons of interest". And wouldn't that be ironic as hell since in the process, the lead detective found himself driving around with a deputy who could've wrapped up the whole case in about an hour.

And Marty's shrink was a dipshit.


2.) Law enforcement, almost all of it, from PCSO management all the way up to the federal level, deliberately conspired to scuttle the investigation because...?

And Marty's shrink was a dipshit.


3.) Being as these cop guys were COPS, they damned well knew what they were doing and they did it as well as they knew. The saga of Chuck and Henry, if otherwise worthless, demonstrates how cops go about their copping when they're serious about it.

The PCSO did not gradually learn about bullshitters and crazy people over the course of several months; they were well aware on the morning they arrived at the cabin that they would be interviewing people who, for whatever whacked reason, *wanted* to somehow feel a part of this thing.

Look at how quickly and efficiently they blew off various people who claimed to have given rides to the boys, to have been outside the window watching the killing, to have seen this or heard that about drug thefts or personal grudges. Nina says that she felt the whole time like the investigators weren't really interested in what she had to say. And i've seen nothing else in the case files remotely resembling the diligent cop work displayed by (unnamed deputy) pursuing Chuck and Henry.

The attention given Marty and Bo was practically equivalent to the attention given Phillip. You know, Phillip, the wacko. The hanger-on exploiting the tragedy to his own ends, inserting himself into the story for a weird combination of beer funding practicalities and warped psychological reasons.

The collective demeanor of investigating officers is very much like, they have to look like they're paying some sort of attention to Marty and Bo because Marilyn said they were murderers so people expected them to be investigated. But the investigations are not serious, they're not followed up, and eventually they tell the POI to get out of town, but only because he is being an obnoxious nuisance. They don't monitor him thereafter and only express half-assed interest in his whereabouts.

It's almost like as if they knew something that effectively ruled out Marty, and so they understood him as just another nutter trying to exploit the thing to his own purposes. It's almost like they couldn't just out and say, "Marty's a nutter" because that would've compromised the investigation. So they only paid as much attention to him as they felt the victim's friends and family expected them to. And so it's like they *didn't* drop the ball after the interview with the shrink, it's like what happened instead was that they compared what Marty said to what they knew, and it only confirmed their belief that Marty was full of crap.

I mean, it's almost very much, like that. But it can't be, right, because...?

And Marty's shrink was a dipshit.
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