Dee's Gun

theories and spec; back up posts w/ reasoning and evidence/examples

Dee's Gun

Postby LizzieB » Tue Jul 30, 2013 4:39 pm

810421 1605 Interview w/ Marilyn.
Bo found an old .22 cal. rifle in the car and brought it into the house and placed it under the couch. Lake had asked for the rifle, but Marty told him he didn't know anything about it. A few days later, Dee's wife asked for the rifle and Marty gave it to her. Interview concluded at this time. {Crim-Bradley interview w/ Marilyn 810421}


810422 A few days later, Lake remembered that he had his rifle in the car and went to Smartt's residence to get it. Lake couldn't find the rifle in the car, so he asked Smartt where it was. Smartt said he didn't know anything about it. Two days later on the 10th, Smartt called Lake and told him he located the rifle in his house and that "Bo" had taken it out of the car and put it in the house without Smartt's knowledge. Lake went to Smartt's the next morning (4-11-81) and took the rifle back to his home in Indian Falls.

As countless theories fun through my mind each time I read up on the case, here is one that I've been thinking about lately..... What if Dee was upset because M & B were not returning his gun? I can't see this 'slight' being overlooked. If I lend someone one my car, and I ask for property back from said car, I expect it back. There is a saying that there is some truth in every lie. What if Johnny and Dana were blamed, justly or not, for Dee's missing gun?
Ok, I've searched for "Blood on Sue's Car" in every way I can think of, but can't find where I read that blood was found on Sue's car. Someone please correct me if I am wrong in that belief.
M & B searching for Dee's missing rifle could account for the blood on the car door handle and the moving of (looking under) the couch after the victims deaths.

I'm past trying to figure out the 'who'. I feel you all have already done that. I'm searching for the 'why'. What do you fellow sleuths think?
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby jhancock » Tue Jul 30, 2013 4:46 pm

I know in a a clip I never used of Richard Meeks, he said he saw blood on Sue's car. He seemed pretty solid in his memory.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby LizzieB » Tue Jul 30, 2013 4:50 pm

Josh, I've looked, but can't find it.... how did you get involved? How are you able to get the info you get? What's your story?

EDIT: Yes, I sound like a jerk teenager who just heard about The Beatles. I get that I'm super late to this party, but I'm so stoked to be involved.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby dmac » Wed Jul 31, 2013 6:05 am

Dee Lake was an accomplice, NOT pissed about his gun. He was INVOLVED.

A .22 pellet does not really match up with the planted idea the gun sight found at the scene (near Sue's head) matches a Daisy air pistol. That match is so INCREDIBLY rare, it's as unique as fingerprints: Daisy didn't sell air pistols with ramps that shot .22 pellets, yet PCSO claim there was no gun involved? Why claim a Daisy sight was found next to Sue's head, when a .22 pellet was found between Johnny and Dana? Match head trauma on the victims with pistol-whipping, I tell you, PCSO and DOJ are lying if they claim it was a Daisy pistol sight.

Dee and Bo and Marty and Loon all talk about borrowing Dee's car, with a gun, for a week prior to the murders. They borrowed the car to use his battery cuz theirs was flat. Really? How does that work, when photos of the crime scene show the hood of the Smartt's car UP, and documentation says same car was on blocks? Why borrow a car for a battery? I think jump-starting was invented long before Bo, the oldest douche in the case (besides his DOJ helpers) was born. Why do you borrow a car to take a battery from it and put it in a dead car? How did PCSO not see that? The fact is, they DID see it and IGNORED IT.

How do you discover and miss a gun under Dee's seat if the sole purpose of his car was the battery? Once the battery was put into the red hatchback on blocks, you don't ever need to look in Dee's car again. yet Bo and Marty both rifled through Dee's car the DAY OF THE MURDERS and magically found a rifle? The whole story is COMPLETE BULL.

The entire story of the CAR is BS, and the 'Dee Rifle' is BULL to detract from the fact a GUN WAS USED in Cabin 28. Bo, Marilyn, Marty ALL brought up Dee's rifle out of the blue for no obvious reason, to dispel the fact they had contact with a gun during the murders. Check it out, Dee has it, the ramp is still on it. DUH! Yet cops were all over Daryl cuz he mentioned he had a gun? How does that work? They knew on Sunday MORNING about Dareyl and his gun, searched his cabin at that time, yet TOTALLY IGNORED Marty and Bo and 26 for days?

Dee Lake is a dildo, and if you think he's not involved, your batteries are dead. Dee loans cars out for flat batteries, I hear. Just say, "my car is up on blocks in my front yard and I need a battery, so can I have your car? Can you magically shove a rifle under the seat?" Just call Dee and say you want to "spend Smartt money on a car". Read up, this is how LAME their lies are.

Look at Dee Jay Lake as the liar and participant he IS. He is LYING about where he was, about his car, about his gun. The killers ditched a gun after the murders and knew they left evidence behind- Bo loved to pistol-whip, and that's how sight ramps dislodge and fall on the ground. They made up the "gun under the couch"story. Quickly and stupidly. No rifle would fit in Dee's car, as they ALL claimed. Sedan with a transmission than ran up the center of the car? NO WAY there was a rifle under that seat! No physical possibility you could put a rifle under Dee's car's seats. Look at that FACT when determining if Dee was INVOLVED IN THE MURDERS.

Cops knew they were lying, so ask Doug Thomas why Doug Thomas is such a piece of crap. Ask why DeCrona and Stoy aren't in jail. They all deserve to die behind bars. Nope, they retire on stolen boats.

The Dee Lake rifle story is complete hogwash, just like the car it was wrapped in. Dee's car was at Marty's cabin the day of the murders. Since we know the whole "loaned car" story is bs, ask why Dee's car was there.

Dee picked up Marty and Bo at 26 on Sunday, and then drove past PCSO scum to pick up Tina's body, and drove to the Meeks house, and then to Camp Eighteen to throw Tina away like trash.

Again, Dee Lake is proved involved in building and perpetrating the Loonibi. He was also actively involved in the coverup. Explain his car.

Dee was not worried about his gun, Johnny and Dana didn't know about Dee's non-existent car loan or the rifle under the seat that cannot possibly fit there.

Dee was involved in the murders. So was his car. That's as black-and-white as it can get.

PS what does that photo have to do with your post? Ask why the couch was moved multiple times during the murders, why Johnny's empty wallet was found behind the couch, why Sue is laying on top of blood stains caused long before she was placed over them, why Dana was on top of the heaviest blood stains when he died first from strangulation, why this photo is of the WRONG side of the cushion from when Dana was found and is aligned with other blood patterns, not how Dana was staged.

Why cover up these murders? Money, power, control. All are involved, so what was DOJ into in 1980? They jumped into this case and derailed it before Thomas/PCSO could on their own. DOJ has an ongoing concern with this case, because they are lying. Look at PCSO and DOJ as the criminals they are.

Others were involved in Keddie. Not just Bo and Marty. Sounds a tad whacky, but we know DOJ for protecting their own interests, and in this case they had common goals with PCSO. How did DOJ overtake the investigation in one DAY?

PPS the killers flipped the cushion at some point. Why? Was Marilyn a neat freak? if you can figure out what the cops know here, tell me. They are trying to match BOTH sides of the cushion stains with the massive blood flow on the floor.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby LizzieB » Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:37 am

dmac wrote:PS what does that photo have to do with your post?
I posted the photo just to show how the couch was moved. My thinking was that M & B could have been searching for something, and lifted the couch to look underneath.

Thank you for your well thought out response, DMAC. I appreciate you taking the time.

It's disheartening to know that this case would have been solved had LE practiced good police work. Shit, even sub-par work would have done the job.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby Eastern » Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:02 am

In the pic that Lizzie posted, it shows sections of carpet cut out by LE. I'm wondering if it's the norm or a reason to only cut out those sections when there's a lot of other bloody sections of carpet.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby dmac » Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:17 am

this photo was days later and done solely to line up the other side of the bloody cushion with staging somebody figured out. But to answer the Q, I again point to the Cielo Drive scene, where blood was everywhere and cops took incredibly few samples, leaving entire sections and blood patterns untouched. There was a perfectly good fingerprint in blood on the button to the entrance gate, and cops pushed the button, destroying the print. Just a few similarities between how LE handled both cases- one from an elite Hollywood Hills estate where Cary Grant, Candice Bergen, Lillien Gish, Henry Fonda, and many others lived at Cielo prior to Polanski/Tate leasing it. Meanwhile, past residents of Cabin 28? Who knows, they were all off the radar of history until April 12, 1981.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby jhancock » Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:28 am

I located these notes today regarding the pellet gun.

Edit: if I posted this document before, I apologize. I came across it today and it hadn't looked familiar.
You must be a member of the Keddie Forum with 15 approved posts to view the files attached to this post.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby Eastern » Thu Aug 01, 2013 10:08 pm

jhancock wrote:
cop notes.jpg


I located these notes today regarding the pellet gun.

Edit: if I posted this document before, I apologize. I came across it today and it hadn't looked familiar.



Josh, can you post what's written on the reverse side? We can see a lot of it, but can't tell what all is said. There's something about tape written, too.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby ache » Fri Aug 02, 2013 1:48 am

From what I can see, it says -

"How about checking with Ventura (or whoever has jurisdiction over homicide he was arrested for) and see if we can compare the tape to bind victim with our tape if they have any as evidence,
See you when you come up"

It is signed what looks like DM but I guess is DS
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby dmac » Mon Aug 05, 2013 7:42 am

jhancock wrote:I know in a a clip I never used of Richard Meeks, he said he saw blood on Sue's car. He seemed pretty solid in his memory.

I've notice Richard M is amazingly solid in his memory, and usually quite conversant with all the circumstances surrounding a particular point, and the circumstances surrounding those, etc. I've never really been able to poke glaring holes or inconsistencies into what he's said over the years. Has anyone?
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby Indigo » Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:08 pm

jhancock wrote:I know in a a clip I never used of Richard Meeks, he said he saw blood on Sue's car. He seemed pretty solid in his memory.

jhancock wrote:There is footage of Tina's memorial in Part I, during which Glenna Meeks speaks briefly about Tina and her granddaughter (the child that Sheila and Richard Meeks had together). I don't know if I see exactly what D sees in that footage, but I do have a deleted scene in which Glenna makes it clear that there was some obvious tension, disagreement, and/or anger between Sue, Sheila, Richard and Glenna about the whole situation; as to the specifics of that tension, I have no idea except that Glenna said Sue was not pleased about it.

Josh - Will you ever make them available to us? :wut: Inquiring minds want to know! :grin:
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby Magesta » Sat Jan 17, 2015 6:25 pm

Were they referring to Ward Weaver, when they checked the gun and saw it was not the same but was a Daisy 880?
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby dmac » Sat Jan 17, 2015 6:30 pm

Explain. The document is the best ref. There are three Ward Weavers. WWii is the asshole serial killer referred to in the above doc. His son, WWiii, is the one who handed over the broken- and unrelated- Daisy rifle. WWiii grew up to be another serial killer, just like his asshole ancestors. Read above, and search the forum. A reporter/lawyer writing a book abt them joined the board, but she never posted. She only came on to leech info, like douchebag Dave Keller.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby Magesta » Sun Jan 18, 2015 4:01 am

Yes I did read about them on the forum, was wondering if they were talking about that crew in the notations they made on the above document. Which raises the question, why look at known murder for this, when they knew who did it and covered it up.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby dmac » Sun Jan 18, 2015 4:20 am

there were many what I deem 'perfunctory investigations' into others known for murders in 81. The main thing is who was where and when, not just serial killers but bad cops. Look at all the serial killers in the world (98.6% of first-time visitors to this site chalk Keddie up to their fave serial killer, they never read anything which smashes their ignorant assumptions), then timeline the child rapists and whores working at PCSO-- you'll see we still have a bigger issue trusting ANY LE.

What is "that crew"?

You don't find it funny/odd that our best info on the gun is a document where LE is comparing Keddie to a serial killer who buried a nice girl in his back yard, then dug her up and moved her remains? Hideous family of killers, and absolutely nothing to do with Keddie. BCSO and PCSO being pals, trading bullshit. They drew his name out of a "nearby killers" hat, that's as far as it goes. Were it a legit case, that's a boring shit report (despite the illiterate document). Considering LE gave the killers a circle-jerk...?

BCSO had a drone bee named Bill Elliott. PCSO still has a complete twat known as Bill Elliott, but they call him Sparky and give him kibble and water in bowls by the front door of their office. He actually ran "the Keddie Investigation" under Hagwood, before Greg transferred the case to retired Gamberg. Applaud now. Stop applauding. Barf now.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby Magesta » Sun Jan 18, 2015 8:42 am

'That crew' is referring to the murdering Weaver family. I do think it is natural to look at the notorious crimes in and around the area of the murders in order to do a thorough investigation and that is most likely why so many people look at those first, such as Side Track or the Weaver's. Then you have the Wonderland murders, which happened after the Keddie murders in a similar way{blungeoning} in L.A. with Eddie Nash and Johnny Holmes, drug trafficking and money laundering in 1981. The information we have to go by in this murder [Keddie} is the information the local police have provided in their reports & photos at the time of the crime {spoon fed us} or left out, which is why we are scrutinizing every detail. We can sit around and btch about the corruption of the police till the cows come home, but it hits a wall.

Yes this points to a cover up. Is it because the PCSD was looking out for their own interest ? or was there a bigger reason for it? I'm not saying roll over and just accept it, I'm saying what's next? Maybe there is something in the details of the crime that point to where to go next. Without the DNA results pointing directly to specific people involved, most is speculation. I keep going back to why would Bo jump into this mess? I don't claim to know what goes on in a murderers mind, it just seems to make more sense that he would not want to be involved if it didn't benefit him in some way, especially if he were in the WPP, which I believe I read on this forum at one time, Deb indicated he was, unless that has since been proven to be incorrect. I feel in order to know the deeper reasoning behind these murders, you have to look at things that may seem ridiculous or trivial or who was committing crimes like this in the area first. It could be the smallest thing that breaks this wide open. I'm not convinced that M,M & B were so in tune to every detail that they committed the perfect crime by covering every aspect of this murder up. Yes with a little help from their friends, they walked free but why and something must have been overlooked. I feel we are giving all involved too much credit to think they wouldn't miss something.There has been a ton of work here by a lot of people to find the answers to those questions and you all have done exceptional work, but here we are still 34 years later still trying to figure out where this is going. It's hard to wrap your head around that these murders may have been committed by a raging animal, who was angry over someone trying to convince his wife to leave him, seems to me he was doing a pretty good job on his own of convincing his wife to leave him and murdering your neighbor is not the way to your woman's heart.

The crime scene was staged and it appears the information we have such as, reports from the police are purposely fashioned so this crime will never be solved and will continue to lead anyone looking into this to go through a revolving door over and over again.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby dmac » Mon Jan 19, 2015 6:10 pm

sorry I didn't know what "the Crew" meant, and the rest of your post is a blur to me. Not an insult, I simply don't understand it. You've got great ideas, but I simply don't understand your last post.
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby Magesta » Mon Jan 19, 2015 7:04 pm

Sorry you didn't understand it, I guess I didn't make a clear point and it seemed like rambling. I was trying to make a couple of points and one just led to another.
1. It's natural while doing a investigation into a murder like this to look at serial killers in the area, such as the Weavers.
2. The consensus is M,M & B did this with help from others and it was covered up, there must have been something that was overlooked and that's why I keep going over the crime scene evidence, facts and files to see what did they miss that could possibly answer how and why this went down.
However, if the reports are fudged [for example one report was written on 4/15 and stated they were at the scene for 6 days, but the crime happened on 4/11-4/12], then the information provided just leads around and around to no where. [revolving door].
3. So where do you go from here?
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Re: Dee's Gun

Postby dmac » Thu Jan 22, 2015 2:48 pm

1-The only member of the Crew working was WW2, and he was a long-haul driver who attacked women, or young couples. His crimes and victims occurred over a vast area. The girl he buried in his back yard? She came from miles away, and he eventually dug her up and put her elsewhere.

Many people still attribute Keddie to their fave serial killers, without ever bothering to read why Bo and Marty and Loon are widely seen as the key players. They are usually bona fide bozos, too stupid to read. The total number of serial killer murders per annum supposedly account for less than 1% of murders each year. If the Plumas region had a serial killer working the area, he'd still need a proclivity for killing multiple victims, etc, etc. Keddie smacks of a personal attack done by someone the vics knew who also lived nearby.

3- Loads of places to go. Have you compared the two timelines LE composed (which we label 'A' and 'B') compared to Timeline Z, which actually quotes documents directly instead of divining incorrect info from them, which LE clearly did? Read the reports, read the Stoy report and the Stoy photo/evidence field report. Read the FBI report which clearly indicates LE were feeding the FBI info they invented.

I know the case seems like it's in chaos, but consider how many walls were still in place just 2 years ago, 4 years, 6? Join the Wrecking Crew, we know something's still rotten in Denmark, and we're still workin' it!
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