Why nobody heard anything

theories and spec; back up posts w/ reasoning and evidence/examples

Why nobody heard anything

Postby bliss » Fri Nov 04, 2011 3:23 pm

OK, I think this may need to be discussed. [maybe not]

I have my opinion about this[of course!!]

A few years ago in Chester a teenager and her boyfriend were brutally murdered in her bedroom
by her ex boyfriend. They say is was a horrific murder and he used a knife.
Her mother was sleeping in the house and never heard a thing.
She did not know it had happened until she went in the room the next day.

My point for saying all this is I have seen many people wondering WHY nobody heard anything and how it
doesn't seem possible. Its amazing what some people can sleep through.

So, maybe this post needs deleted, I don't know anymore which posts should be here or not, and in notwanting to make the board clogged with so many posts that new people can't easily read old posts because theres so many. But, I just wanted to give my opinion as to why I feel that nobodt heard the screams and fighting back the night of the murders. I do not believe its just because nobody wanted to step forward, but it IS feasible that nobody heard.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby Chichibcc » Fri Nov 04, 2011 4:03 pm

Maybe the lack of sound had to do with the thickness of the cabin walls, perhaps?

I used to think the trees also had a lot to do with blocking potential transfer of sound...but after seeing the archival news footage from 1981, the trees I saw didn't really have full-grown leaves yet, since it was only mid-April.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby Eastern » Fri Nov 04, 2011 8:29 pm

A couple did hear muffled screams. Bliss has a good point though. Especially when people are sleeping and lapsing in and out of sleep wondering if they heard anything.

What I think is very likely is that the Seabolt's dog barking prevented the most likely neighbors from hearing anything. Mrs. Seabolt said their dog never barked at night except for that night - that it was barking it's head off - over the couch where Sheila was sleeping I think she said.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby Ausgirl » Fri Nov 04, 2011 9:40 pm

Sue lived maybe a 2-min walk from the bar - was music from the bar, and cars as people left another factor maybe (assuming there was some noise)? If a dog barking woke people, and some 'muffled screams' ...

Another thought is that maybe they didn't wake Sue up before attacking her (assuming there wasn't).
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby azucena » Fri Nov 04, 2011 10:42 pm

This has bothered me also, and the explanation of the thickness of the walls does not satisfy me, as those cabins were old and built without much insulation, but they did have stout timbers. However, I think the timeframe is crucial: If the perps were able to subdue things in the house quickly, i have realized there could have been little outside noise discerable to others, which leads me to my biggest thought here: THERE WERE MORE THAN TWO PERPS or the number of people in the house changed as the time passed and others arrived at the cabin as the night progressed
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby azucena » Fri Nov 04, 2011 10:51 pm

Aus you are so awesome !!!
I have been in Keddie extensively, and from what In know about the loacation of the bar and various houses, including Sue's home, I do not think bar noise would have been a factor. Cars driving by would have been normal, and the fact the community was quiet and used to quiet would have de sensitized people, UNLESS the noise was going on for a long while.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby dmac » Fri Nov 04, 2011 11:51 pm

I believe the quote in part one- to paraphrase, "those in Keddie that day will forever remember the blood-curdling scream of Sheila that rainy April morning"- is what is considered "poetic license". In other word, that cliched purple prose is pure bullshit. Sheila can please correct me here, but I'v never heard comment from anybody that she ever screamed that morning.

Regardless, it's apples and oranges: The boys and Tina heard what was happening. The walls of the cabin, the trees, the cold and thin night air, the sound of the runoff-swollen river yards away, all of it conspired to muffle what went on inside. I believe some did hear some of what went down, but the biggest reaction was residents noticing unusual behavior by their pets.

Argue all you want about who may have heard what, and why, but here's the crux of it. Some heard something and truthfully reported it. Others likely heard things and didn't tell the truth about it. And some of those knew something was going down.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby tinkerbell » Sat Nov 05, 2011 7:54 am

D
On my way down to do the interview I stopped by and saw the neighbor I had stayed the night and we did end up talking about that morning. We have never discussed it before because it was just to hard for her. She is the one that told me that I was screaming and she is the one who said I said it was Johnny.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby Ausgirl » Sat Nov 05, 2011 8:31 am

Sheila, thanks for clearing that up.

As to the topic of 'hearing' -- I was doing a pile of research on similar home invasion attacks just now, and found that isn't unusual for neighbours and even people in the same house to hear nothing , or only small sounds they didn't think much of at the time. And in some of these crimes, neighbours heard enough to wake them up, but didn't investigate and years later are still wracked with guilt about it. I'll add that in most of these similar crimes where not much or nothing is heard, the killers have overwhelmed their victims quickly, often while they are still asleep.

Which makes me re-think the sequence of events somewhat.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby ache » Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:43 am

It was windy here the other night and while sitting in my house listening to my windows rattle and bang whilst the climbing roses scraped and knocked against the walls, I thought *anything* could be going on at my next door neighbours and I wouldn't hear a thing. The windows in my house are the old, wooden kind - probably very much like every single cabin in Keddie had back in 1981. My guess is that everyone who lived there was used to quite a lot of noise occurring and if there were more than a gentle breeze blowing that night, most of the noise from outside was probably quite dulled by the noise each residents own house was making. I don't know if wind was a factor that night, but I do know that old timber houses are noisy and it would explain why a scream was heard, but things such as knives pounding into walls etc, were not.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby 7Scarlet » Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:16 am

There are a couple of reasons why no sounds were heard or remembered about that night, probably.

People think that when something like this happens, there has to be a lot of noise involved (screaming, thumping, etc). The fact is, this is not always true, and more often than not it isn't true at all. Often, these events happen so quickly and people are taken so by surprise, they go quickly into shock mode and don't utter much of any sound at all, if any. And clearly, the murderers here had control over everyone, and that control likely happened immediately.

Also, I can't count how many times in my life I've awoken, or been startled by, or took notice of, a brief, out of place sound. I would have a short, 'wtf was that?' moment, hear nothing else, and forget about it. While I know this has happened a number of times, I couldn't describe now any specific event. Moments like that don't register properly in our memory banks.

Could explain why not much commotion was heard or remembered.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby TREELAND » Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:20 am

With all that occured during the homicides such as wires being cut, victims tied , Sue being gagged with panties and tape, tape used on the other victims, and the walls knifed some time must to have passed with on and off noices through the night. Also the abduction of Tina and sadly even her possible murder before she was removed from the cabin took some time and caused other sounds such as when she might have been carried down the back steps. She might still have been alive if it is true Justin saw her grabbed and carried away by the assailants with her screaming help twice and there was the waitress leaving the Keddie bar that while in the parking lot of lodge heard and man and women's voice after hearing a sound like something being put in a car. I wonder if when she heard these sounds there was something for example distressing in the voices she heard because she mentioned she dropped her keys, was it because she was startled and alarmed? It seemed ominous too that Mrs. Seabolt mentioned that her husband didn't sleep well that night which seems like he may have been hearing things at random intervals over a long period and not completely waking up. The victim's most likely were incapacitated right away in the aspect that they could not call out for help but it seems they were terrorized for a time before their deaths. It seems to the perpertrators returned later to move the victims which might have made sounds such as creaking doors and footsteps. The sounds must have been so intermittant like the couple in Cabin 16 that heard muffled screams briefly or the women that awoke from sleeping in a chair and said she heard nothing but maybe a noise is why she originally woke up, that they were accepted for just the sounds of that night.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby Tennessean » Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:58 am

Considering the muffled scream reported from cabin 16 at 1:15 or 2:30 (there is conflicting data on map and timeline), if this is truthful I don't believe that anyone within the cabin slept through this rampage, I would think that a sound like that would wake even Rip Van Winkle and it would sound like terror. I live in a house with brick on all sides and coincidentally I just heard a mother talking to her little girl about thirty feet away in a normal tone and I can hear birds chirping outside and its 10 in the morning, now I realize that it is my one wall versus 2 walls between cabins for sound mitigation, but I don't understand how cabin 27 heard nothing. There is also the additional element that this occured very late at night and all the children in the community were in bed so if you heard a scream at 1 in the morning you wouldn't right it off as children at play outside. I have never been to this area, but I'm not sure how much the bar would factor in as background noise to help the killers maintain their evil work while staying under the radar. The cabins are all so close in proximity to one another...how was this all possible? Then consider that a child was abducted! This all does not seem possible with only two people involved in the murder.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby 7Scarlet » Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:13 am

Something happened to me a really long time ago, with people not too far away. No one heard anything.

But really, it happened so fast I didn't have time to scream or make a lot of noise. I remember crying, but not screaming, or making any sound loud enough to alert anyone. But, it was a really long time ago, more than twenty years, so my memory of it isn't all that fantastic and I don't really want to remember anyway. And I could barely breathe for most of it, so I couldn't have been loud if I wanted to. Bleh.

I just know that even horrific events can be pretty quiet indeed. Surprisingly so.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby Tennessean » Sat Feb 16, 2013 6:02 am

So sorry to hear that, Scarlet.
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Re: Why nobody heard anything

Postby Cheshire » Sat Feb 16, 2013 3:51 pm

I always wondered if sound was masked by a train going through town. I know that's very Hitchcock, but when I started looking into it a few months ago, I stumbled across this:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=820&p=10837&hilit=train#p10837 (You'll need to scroll down the page a bit, as I couldn't make a more direct link, but here's the excerpt):

Mon Aug 08, 2011 3:30 pm
Forum: excerpts from case files
Marty's interview with DOJ - complete transcript
... a piece of wood, came back in, I didn't notice anything. Crim: Just nice and quiet? Smartt: Quiet, as a matter a fact, usually about that time, a train is going by, I didn't notice the train, then go to sleep. Very peaceful and quiet, I can't think of anything.
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