Weapon #4 Determined?

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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Fri Sep 11, 2015 9:26 am

I ran across something recently indicating Justin's shoes were taken into evidence- oh, yeah, Stoy makes that claim in Pt 2. I've been meticulously reading through all the case files Josh sent me before shipping them back to PCSO, and thought I'd read it there. Nope, Stoy talks about it. Stoy is only reliable when it comes to lying, though.
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby Cheshire » Fri Sep 11, 2015 5:54 pm

There is no way to fully comprehend what any of the kids would have done after experiencing this level of unimaginable trauma. Current research on the neurobiology of trauma indicates that it essentially changes the way the brain develops. Childhood trauma like this can be far more serious than what veterans experience. One of the "symptoms" is hypervigilance (which is akin to paranoia). Unfortunately, I think that all that has been discovered in recent years about the role of law enforcement in this case makes it even more likely that they will never feel safe talking about what happened that night.
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Sat Sep 12, 2015 2:07 am

Perfectly stated, Chesh. Unfortunately, I think your statement is far more fact than opinion. Even Sheila admits to silencing the boys on the topic, so they literally had nowhere to turn if they wanted to discuss what really happened. Plus Greg was only five, so Rick probably couldn't even confide in his own brother.

Admittedly another under-educated Justin basher for a long time (an environment Josh willfully sustained), I finally realized how he'd been completely f*cked in life. When he tried to tell the truth about the murders, he was talking to Marty's pals at PCSO who were already busy screwing over the case. What they did to Justin alone must go well beyond intentional deafness. Many others have accused the Sharp boys (men) of holding back. I think anyone taking that opinion about Rick, Greg, or Justin should read your post. In fact, I'd like to copy it over to a thread I began today, to answer why the survivors keep quiet.

I believe the LE factor is, by far, the most disgusting aspect of this entire true horror story. It's also a perfect example of why I believe in bringing back quick verdicts and public executions for corrupt public servants (cops, politicians, etc).
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby BUTTERFLYVALLEY1 » Sun Oct 04, 2015 5:59 am

What about an expandable baton? I believe they came out in the 80s - just a thought but very thin, sturdy, and unique end to it. Just a thought and I have been up all night! :-?
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Sun Oct 04, 2015 11:02 am

I thought you might be winding me up or Extracting a Michael in English parlance (taking a Mickey). But, realizing it's you, Bfly, I know you're not kidding. That's why it's even funnier- take a look at how this entire thread began...

I've been meaning to post something about this for a good damned long time but never got around to it, as it deserves a more thought-out reply than I'm about to give:

I'm thinking W4 may have been the rifle barrel all along. Not that the table leg wasn't ripped off and used somehow at some time- it's clearly not attached to the table... but the round wounds at the tip of the W4 wounds could be hammer wounds, not attributable to as a unique design of W4. The circumferences match the other hammer wounds perfectly, but what's so damned odd is the bludgeon wounds almost perfectly and identically mask the hammer wounds: Right at the tip on two or all three instances of head trauma- even to the soft tissue of Dana's outer ear.

Both sight mounts broke off of the barrel and were found on the floor near Sue. There are bizarre and nearly identical wounds to the bridges of Sue's and Johnny's right eye/nose bridge. Most importantly, there's a wound to Sue's right cheek just above her cheek bone that looks to be a perfect match for the sight on the tip of the barrel. Maybe I can find a way to post it without it being too detailed/graphic/gory, but I'm quite reluctant to show any of this stuff anymore because assholes rip it off and use it to get their cheap jollies all over the web. Humans are so disgusting, eh?

Back to point- the rifle was clearly brought to the scene by the killers. A round was fired (pellet recovered), and both sights were knocked off the barrel, indicating the barrel was used to batter and bludgeon. Ergo, W4 is the rifle barrel.
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Sun Oct 04, 2015 11:51 am

Go here for the graphic indicating the rifle sight matches a wound to Sue's face. To quote myself from the new thread, it's important to confirm:

    "This does not mean the table leg was not used somehow at some time, as the leg was clearly ripped from the frame of the folding table. LE mentioned furniture was broken and used to batter victims, but let's take that with a bucket of salt: DeCrona is a scumbag who revels in tall tales, like a campfire girl trying to get gorier with each new telling."
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Tue Oct 06, 2015 5:38 pm

Consider the very strong possibility corrupt members of LE, such as DeCrona, overplayed furniture from 28 being broken and used as weapon(s) by the killers.

Why? To disguise the fact LE knows killers brought their own weapons to the crime, completely upturning LE's blanket lie that the crimes at 28 were spur-of-the-moment. I'm not convinced the murders were planned, but a felony home invasion was.

Was a home invasion a felony in CA in 81? On the 1981 CA law books, what crimes did the killers commit with a home invasion on Sue and family, particularly if Justin (and Casey) were at a 'sleepover' ? Laws have changed dramatically in intervening years. Killers were two doors away, and so many weapons and constraints never originated from 28. Many questions of timing and 'original intent' follow, but several assholes committed this mass murder, and several more tax-paid corrupt LE assholes happily amplified the crimes against those they're sworn to protect.

There's impossible odds backing a bet even a moron like Bo walked into 28 thinking a quad would happen. I also think he'd be the first to say "these people must now die" to protect his ID. So, why was Bo caught dead or alive in 28 in the first place? He's a complete mob moron, we know that, but why was he in Keddie? The VA story is a big lie, so why did Dee take Marty to the VA, yet Marty came back with Bo ten days before the murders?

These are the bigger speculation Qs that I think about, after boiling down obvious Qs. Basically, how did Bo already know Marty and/or Loon, and why was he at cabin 26 in corrupt Plumas, and why is his record now wiped? I haven't had any advancement on them in months, other than Dee being hugely involved and DT living at 28. And all our other work. This is a loose-knit community where several people are chipping away, pretty blindly and independently of each other, and coming up with similar and different results.
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Wed May 25, 2016 5:09 pm

In observing autopsy photos, there are a series of the Weapon Four wounds after the head is shaved. On close inspection, these wounds bear the same pattern of stripes which the ME mentions re: the wounds to Sue's thigh:

"The left thigh shows over its anteromedial aspect, an oblique rectangular shaped bruise mark with oblique lines in its center."

That's a dead-on description of the pattern on Dana's head wounds. Same pattern, same weapon.

Also, despite the fact the autopsy fails to make mention of it, there's the wound to Dana's thigh I've constantly been bitching about for years, and how it is probably the same weapon as that used to create the bruise to his head and buttocks. Well, the autopsy fails to mention it because it's a botched autopsy. The autopsy photos Dan Forcino took show the ME took a crossection of both the buttock and thigh wounds.

Same weapon used. Refer to here.

For reference, Mike mentioned the autopsies were done by the county coroner, whose work was compromised by an unbelievably heavy volume of bodies and severely understaffed office.
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Thu Jun 16, 2016 3:47 pm

UPDATE. Read to the end.

That leg was still torn from the frame of the table, but find a folding table with a leg featuring the pattern found on #4 wounds.

As for old comments by asshats in the Old Guard PCSO (read: DeCrona, the boasting felon), when it comes to PCSO claiming "blood absolutely everywhere" and "furniture all busted up", the only thing 'broken' I noticed in CS photos actually attributable to the murders are the table leg and the 880 rifle sights. The cheap table knife used in postmortem stabbing could be called 'broken', but it certainly wasn't "almost doubled back" as some have claimed (read: shitstain DeCrona, the boasting felon).
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:20 pm

I've asked Mike Gamberg about this several times and have never been held back from disclosure:

Gamberg has found nothing concerning the folding card table <much less the table leg clearly torn from it> in any files, photos, tapes, EVIDENCE, PERIOD.

Rod Corrupt Fuck-Knob DeCrona, what did you mean by 'furniture torn apart' to bludgeon the victims? How are you the exponent and proof of this angle of coverup? Why do only YOU back up convincing proof the table had blood spatter on it, and one leg was not connected?

Why is Rod DeCrona such a piece of shit? Look this scumfuck bitch up, down, sideways. He's a key component.
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Mon Oct 17, 2016 2:25 pm

From the FBI Quantico transmission dated 6z APR 81:

    A HAMMER WAS THE APPARENT INSTRUMENT USED IN THE
    BEATING OF GLENNA AND JOHN AND A CLAW HAMMER AND A BLUNT INSTRUMENT
    SUCH AS THE BARREL OF A RIFLE WERE THE MURDER WEAPONS ON DANA
    WINGATE.

Rifle, rifle. gun sight, rifle, barrel, rifle.

WHERE THE F DID THESE CLAIMS COME FROM in the early shadows of a completely fucked mis-investigation?

Even the FBI knew the killers brought a rifle to a sex crime, yet they were not willing to tell anyone that the fabricated lie about Keddie being a random kill of opportunity was complete bullshit.

Willing? Look at Bo's protection. Able?!
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Mon Apr 17, 2017 4:39 am

In looking again at all the autopsy diagrams, I've come to the conclusion Weapon 4 didn't have any circular deviation that created the defects described by the pathologist. The clue is in the size of the circular patterns: One is 3/4", the other is 5/8".

These are the sizes of the two hammers used in the attacks. It just so happens two W4 wounds almost perfectly overlay the hammer wounds on Dana. This also explains why the 5/8" hammer wound extends just beyond the dimensions of one W4 wound.

Dana had three hammer wounds to the left side of his head (2 5/8" hammer wounds, one 3/4"). He also had a 3/4" hammer wound to the back right side, behind his ear. And a 5/8 hammer hit to his mouth.

Sue had no obvious hammer wounds, other than a 5/8 blow to the mouth.

Johnny had (1) 3/4" to the left side of his head (causing a deep fracture underneath), two 5/8"ers that also fractured, causing his brain to protrude. The ME also described (2) 1/2" circular wounds to the left side of his head, which may only be a description of the size of the mark rather than the diameter. Of course, it could also mean a third hammer was in play. The barrel of the rifle may also have created a wound roughly 1/2" in diameter:

    "The left side of the scalp shows numerous lacerations (7). Some of these
    are curved, some are straight, and one is stellate. They occur from the
    frontal to the occipital region and vary in length from l/2 inch up to
    l-l/2 inches in greatest dimension. See the drawing and the photographs
    for details of these wounds."

P9253342.jpg


I don't know, man... I think I just talked myself out of believing the rifle barrel could possibly have caused those wounds... Then again, looking at the 1/2" wound next the puncture on Sue's faced caused by the sight, it' definitely possible the tip of the barrel was used to pummel the victims.

My bet is the hammer from the pond is 5/8", and Johnny's wood-handled hammer is 3/4". The 5/8"ers were meant to silence (Dana's / Sue's mouths; crushing blows to skulls), so that's why the 5/8ers are the weapon Marty brought with him to kill.

This is either a third hammer, or the rifle barrel.

Christ- three hammers? Really?!
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby nekogirrl » Tue Apr 18, 2017 12:30 pm

Christ- three hammers? Really?!



why not? don't you think Marilyn might have wanted one of her own?
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Re: Weapon #4 Determined?

Postby dmac » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:01 pm

1/2" almost nullifies any chance those wounds were caused by a hammer. It's an unusual size, and pretty damned rare. Try to find one the next time you stop by the True Value next to Safeway.
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